AAFD Standards Committee Put in Awkward Position
The American Association of Franchisees and Dealers' 16th Annual Conference has convened in Newport News, Virginia and its Total Quality Franchising awards were presented Monday night.
It was a joyous occassion with a happy message of franchising in a fair way, with one exception. AAFD sent a strong metaphor—a song and dance on the podium numerous times with Cuppy's leaders performing and speaking alongside AAFD leaders.
AAFD Awards Banquet in Newport News, VA 2008
With its standards meeting scheduled for Tuesday and Wednesday, such action raises the question of whether the outcome of Cuppy's being a member in good standing has been pre-determined. Members of AAFD previously had said on Blue MauMau that everyone could present and discuss in a meeting open to the public whether Cuppy's has met AAFD's fair franchising standards over this past year.
Dale Nabors, CEO of Cuppy's Coffee began his speech, "Bob [Purvin] asked me to say this in two minutes or less..."
One naturally asks whether this might be an attempt by the chair to influence the standards committee members attending the banquet.
Perceptions matter. A perception of trying to rehabilitate an image was created from the very moment that Cuppy's president, Doug Hibbing began to sing on the stand. That perception was reinforced when its CEO began his speech.
Nabors admitted, "In my opinion, we [Cuppy's] weren't living up to AAFD standards. Cuppy's had a desire to. I'm here tonight to say that we are going to commit to living up to the AAFD fair franchising standards."
Sounding very similar to commitments made at the AAFD conference in Dallas last year where Cuppy's president Doug Hibbing and his boss's wife, Mrs. Morgan, said that they were honored and that they would change company practices to meet AAFD standards, now Hibbing's new boss, Mr. Nabors says, "Next year we hope our franchise review and our franchisees say we deserve to be here."
The problem for the standards committee on Tuesday and Wednesday is that they must deal with the consequences of the awards banquet.
The issue of whether Cuppy's violated the association's standards has been resolved by the voice of its new CEO. Yes.
The issue for the standards committee is whether the awards banquet mea culpa puts the issue to bed. For the standards committee to do nothing will undermine not only its credibility in this instance but also will lead to the perception (rightly or wrongly) that what matters is a company's relationship with Bob Purvin and not its adherence to AAFD standards.
The statements made tonight, coupled with the song and dance metaphor, place not only the standards committee but Robert Purvin in an awkward position. How they respond over the next two days of meetings may well influence the future of the organization itself.
After Dale Nabors' apology, AAFD's chairman Robert Purvin took the podium. He did not respond to Cuppy's admission, but simply said, "[Dale], I'd like you to present this next [fair franchising] award..."
An award was given out this evening by a presenter whose company by his own admission has not lived up to AAFD standards. Such a presentation undermines the value of the association's fair franchising awards.
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Related Readings
- Roy Snowden Gets Four Years
- Java Jo'z Controversy Gaining Attention Via Blogs by Sean Kelly
- An Interview with Cuppy's Coffee President by Janet Sparks
- How Blogging Saved the World: A Tale of Java Jo'z and Cuppy's Coffee by Don Sniegowski
- Ramblings and a Lesson by Dale Nabors
- Some Words From AAFD On Cuppy's Coffee and Elite Manufacturing by Bob Purvin
- Franchisor Accreditation, AAFD
- The AAFD Awards Cuppy’s Coffee Franchise with Contract Accreditation. by Steven Dubin
- Official Statement from Cuppy's Coffee & More by Cuppy's Coffee
- Franchise topic:
attending meeting
Why do we as Cuppy's victims not attend the meeting? Why? Time and time again people have made promises to mediate or step in on our behalf and nothing has come of it. All we have to show are more bills to pay and more broken promises. How much can one family take and more importantly how much more should we take. Sued by creditors and told over and over again you have claims but you need $$$ to proceed and Cuppy's made sure we have none of that left. How dare people talk about how much more we should do. When is it time for Cuppy's to step up? I know the answer, never. The management before made their money and the new management will continue to make money based on lies and deception where the only mantra is cya (cover your ass). One person we talked to had the nerve to tell us the real victim in all of this was Robert Morgan. Are you freakin' kidding me? Hopefully my husband has not been so beat down and disheartened by this whole thing that he will post all of our info on unhappyfranchisee.com soon. I truly wish those of you who are trying to get your deposits back are successful, at least some of us should be.
AAFD/franchisor discernment or lack thereof
I'm all for any effort that might increase quality franchising, but I don't understand how any organization(s) desiring public support (or desirous of promoting quality) could exercise mutual admiration 'before' resolving obviously important problems, whether those problems are AAFD or franchisor related.
My opinion is that he AAFD allowed an awful lot of PR damage to enter its camp. And that damage probably could have been avoided by pre-conference disclosure of actions (or at least announced 'planned' actions) to rectify a very bad situation.
And a public note to you, Bob – You’re a personable guy and I appreciate your invitations, but I think that this action, if there was any actionable strategic plan at all, was not in the best interests of anyone involved. Although many franchise old timers don't want to believe it, transparency via the internet is now a fact of life. With this said, I'm interested in seeing how this debacle plays out. And, if Webster makes a statement from the ‘boardroom’, I trust that you also, as head of the organization, will tell us what’s going on. Frankly, I think the future of the AAFD will turn on this issue.
By the way, using my own name and contact information, I began the franchising process with Cuppy’s just to get a ‘feel’ for the organization. After an initial conversation with a sales qualifier I was emailed a purchase order for shop equipment that apparently was meant for another prospect. Upon letting the firm know that I was not that prospect, all contact ceased.
Nick Bibby is a franchise consultant and principal of the Bibby Group.
Mutual Admiration Club
Nick writes: "I don't understand how any organization(s) desiring public support (or desirous of promoting quality) could exercise mutual admiration 'before' resolving obviously important problems, whether those problems are AAFD or franchisor related."
Neither do I.
To clarify, I made the statement in the open public standards meeting. If Mr. BMM doesn't report it on in due course, I will.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Cuppy's Depositors Did Not Attend
How important is your missing $30,000? If a company did not refund a deposit on a business, would the deposit be worth the price of a plane ticket and hotel room?
Apparently not.
Despite numerous invitations for Cuppy's Coffee depositors to attend the American Association Franchisee and Dealers annual conference to discuss non-refunded deposits, obtain free attorney service and help mediate payment, there were no Cuppy's Coffee franchise owners or depositors in attendance during the three-day long conference.
From AAFD's own standards:
So, why the hell should these franchisees have to go to Virginia to have this mediated or maybe Cuppy's should have footed their bill:
Cuppy's, Venue and the AAFD
JD is entirely correct, there is no reason for the Cuppy's franchisees entitled to refunds to have travelled to Virginia - a lovely place from which I am posting.
There have been been numerous and important posts raised about Cuppy's. But most people have misunderstood the process.
The Standards Committtee which just finished meeting is not the body that will deal with the Cuppy's accreditation isssue.
The Board of Directors of the AAFD, of which I am now a member, will deal with the issue and make a public report. A number of public statements have been made and will be throughly reviewed for their factual basis.
However, Standard 1.8 allows the accredited company some measure of confidentiality for a review. Until that review is completed, which should be done for the July Board meeting, I will not be commenting on this very important issue.
But some of you may want to ask Mr. Blue MauMau for a full reporting about the comments I made in the Standard's meeting on this issue.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Oxymoron Prize for 2008
AAFD Standards = Prize winning oxymoron. YEA! Give 'em a bloody plaque!--
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Oxymoron
Richard, I have always been amused by your comments - and especially how readily you will admit to being wrong.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Invitation
I'm going to run right out to my mailbox. Maybe my invitation is stuck in a corner wwaaayyy in the back. Please. Why didn't I attend? Because I wasn't invited! However, I did send an e-mail expressing my regrets with the situation.
Why don't molestation victims attend NAMBLA conventions?
It's a puzzler... Why wouldn't victims, who fell for a scam given credibility by a "fair franchising award," spend money to watch the offenders buy rounds of drinks and play rounds of golf with their money? Why can't they take time off from work and dip into their bank accounts so they can see Bob Purvin and Doug Hibbing delight the crowd in a top hat and cane rendition of "Putting on the Ritz"?
Why should someone have to attend a convention to get their own money returned? Unlike many discussed here, this is not a complicated situation. These guys took refundable deposits and are refusing to return it. One can only assume that they've got money to contribute to the AAFD for a fresh supply of smoke and mirrors. They've got money to advertise for new franchise depositors. They've got money to pay someone to post on a couple dozen phony blogs every day. But they can't give people back their own money?
Robyn is working two jobs while going to school, and her husband Corey is too. Criston and her partner are working overtime, as are Lina & Lee Alcafaras and potentially many others.
Have any of you ever had your car stolen, or your house burglarized? Our house was broken into earlier this year while my family slept. It never occurred to me to attend the 16th Annual Home Invader's Association meeting in the hope of getting our stuff back.
Sean Kelly
seankelly[at]ideafarm.net
Franchise Pick
Franchisor Marketing
Refunds
Sean, the information presented to the Board of Directors suggested that these individuals had actually been approved by their bank and then got buyer's remorse.
If you or they have information to the contrary, please email it to me directly.
I will also follow up with these individuals.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Buyer's Remorse, Please!
Michael, buyer's remourse is what Cuppy's gave the board? Well isn't that a new twist on "As the Coffee Goes Cold." I'm sorry, but I must have missed the last few episodes to get to the scene where we all had bank approvals. Last I heard, Cuppy's was giving us in house financing with the SBA's backing on their website to get financed. When suddenly, Morg said, "I'm sorry, there is just no way to get you finaced." Thus the poor hopeful franchisee's went to Elite to ask for a refund of a dream that would never turn into a brick and morter and what is this, they are keeping the funds for the cement. What a twisted plot this has become. Please. I am so friggen tired of seeing Cuppy's/Elite/Medina/Doug/Morg and the rest as the "do good-ers" is this mess. This miniseries has become a tragic drama that continues without end for many of us that just want the season to be over. Perhaps, the Board shoud call on some of these "individuals" to get the full story so we could share our version of buyer's remorse. In the meantime, it looks as though Cuppy's is currently working on their sequal, "Cuppy's on Ice, so Nice!"
Buyer's Remorse Part II
If you made a deposit to Elite, were denied bank approval, and did not get a settlement agreement, then you need to tell the AAFD and me.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Contact Webster
Nobody is saying that this bunch is "good".
I got into a public debate with Cuppy's counsel on Tuesday, and even suggested that the audience go on BMM and look at the letter I got from Nixon Peabody, and also I mentioned the John Dozier intimidation tactics. Moreover, I took issue from the floor with Mr. Purvin on the issue of how long it was taking Cuppy's to issue refunds in cases where there was no argument as to the fact that refunds were owed.
As to the Board calling on some of the zees, Mr. Webster announced that he intended to do so. Previously on BMM he had urged any parties having evidence to submit it to him.
In his recent post, Mr. Webster noted that if his information as to the issuance of financing was in error, Mr. Kelly and/or the affected zees should contact Mr. Webster.
Mr. Webster's report will only be as good as the data submitted to him plus what he is able to garner through his own investigation. Therefore it would appear to be in the interest of parties having a stake in this matter to contact Mr. Webster if they have not already done so.
Mr. Webster is hardly sympathetic to this franchisor, but he is also charged with preparing a report based on facts. The more input, the better.
Paul Steinberg
Franchisee Attorney, New York City, Ph: 212-529-5400
Sex with underage boys?!!
For those outside the US, "NAMBLA" stands for "North American Man-Boy Love Association" and it is an organization which supports pedophilia.
The AAFD did not steal anyone's money. The AAFD does not support pedophilia. The AAFD does not support violation of franchise law; indeed the AAFD attempts to demand more than the statutory requirements.
When I owned a Subway store, my partner used to give coffee to the homeless folks in the wee hours. One day a homeless guy decided he didn't like the coffee and threw it in Gerry's face, and that was the end of that.
Certainly no one is obligated to accept a helping hand. And the AAFD having Doug Hibbing at the annual dinner was just plain stupid. So fine, don't accept the AAFDs coffee. But there's no need to throw it in the offeror's face. Mr. Purvin may have misjudged the franchisor, but his efforts at getting these deposits returned springs from a genuine effort to get this money returned.
The alternative is to follow the advice of Mr. Solomon. He charges $1000 for his "Do Diligence FranWhack" in which after your check clears he tells you not to buy a franchise. If you have done so, he tells you to give him a 5-figure retainer and he'll sue. And unless you are nearing a Statute of Limitations deadline, why not first try a low-cost alternative?
Oh... and while you are on the subject of what non-parties are doing wrong, how about the responsibility of the purchasers? Unlike your offensive NAMBLA reference, these are not 8-year old boys. They are grown adults who gave their franchise fee to a construction company and neither they nor their attorneys found anything odd about that. They are grown adults whose legal counsel didn't demand that funds whcih should have been in an attorney escrow account were placed in the proper account. These are not children, they are adults. These are not burglary victims, they are people who voluntarily wrote checks and didn't exercise as much common sense as they should have.
I do not excuse the behavior of the franchisor. I remain dubious that this franchisor has a long-term future. Mr. Hibbing is actually a nice guy, but I don't trust him nor do I think much of his business acumen or ethics, and why Dale Nabors hasn't given him a severance check is beyond me.
I disagreed strongly with Mr. Purvin, as did Mr. Webster and others. But the AAFD was not responsible for what Robert Morgan and Doub Hibbing did. The AAFD did not have sex with children or burgle homes--it offered to try and help in a contract dispute, and one would think that Sean Kelly would be supportive of an attempt to get this money returned.
Internet scandal is hugely entertaining--and at times useful in bringing public pressure to bear--but ultimately those who are serious about this may wish to attempt a resolution. If not, skip that step and call Mr. Solomon and write him a big check. Your decision.
Paul Steinberg
Franchisee Attorney, New York City, Ph: 212-529-5400
Risky Business
What Morgan did was wrong: he made risky bets in a time of a credit crunch. It was a bad business decision. It hurt a lot of people.
I believe that Bob Purvin accepts this, and I also believe that Cuppy's in house counsel believes this.
However, as Richard is so fond of stating, there is no nanny state nor should there be one. For whatever reason, some propsective franchisees gave money to a construction company that for all they knew could have been insolvent.
It does not appear that anyone of them consulted a franchisee attorney before committing themselves to a purchase costing them over 150k.
That was a bad decision.
However, the AAFD has been instrumental in making some people's bad decisions turn out better.
The AAFD's accreditation award made Cuppy's produce refunds faster with less expense than Richard, Paul or I could have done through litigation. (This is why Richard is so harsh - he is losing a possible fee.)
Have we been perfect? No.
Could we have been better in preventing this situation? I believe that we could have, said so at the Standards Meeting, and am working to ensure that the next accredited contract review works better.
Will we get it perfect next time around? No. But we can make it more likely that real collaborative franchising will work.
Personally, I am appreciative of the work that Sean Kelly has done to keep this issue alive and in the fore front. Public pressure on a franchisor does work for reputable franchise systems.
Not everyone is going to be satisified - bad decisions were made all around. But only the AAFD's accredited contract status made many of the outcomes of these bad decisions better, quicker and with less expense than litigation.
As I have said on other posts, if anyone has information that suggests that either there are more than 3 Cuppy's franchisees with unresolved problems or that the settlement agreement violated the AAFD's Standard on "Gag" clauses, they should email me.
The AAFD's review of the Cuppy's accreditation status should be done in a preliminary fashion by July, with the final review ready for the Standards meeting in September.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
Cuppy's.. give me a break
This comment has been moved here.
Thank you, Paul...
for that ringing endorsement.
Just to be clear - you weren't suggesting that my fee structure is unreasonable, were you?
If yours is lower, well - - you know what you're worth.--
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Jokes aside
No, the fee is not unreasonable and that is the point. Litigation is expensive and emotionally draining. It is also a lot less of a slam-dunk than the client usually believes.
Under the circumstances, if there is an organization which has a chance of obtaining a non-judicial resolution, that would seem to be worth a shot.
Whining may be cathartic, but it won't put money in your pocket and if all these folks are going to do is whine and snap at anyone who offers a productive option, they will end up with lots of fellow whiners on BMM. Misery loves company.
Paul Steinberg
Franchisee Attorney, New York City, Ph: 212-529-5400
AAFD GONE BAD
Sean- I couldn't agree with you more. I still can't believe that it was admitted by Dale Nabors that they do not live up to AAFD Standards and have not been fair- take away the damn recognition! Cuppy's does not deserve that for how they treat people. I have one word...... Selfish.
Sean Kelly
You are right on the money. I love your post. Why would anyone want to go to a meeting when they know Cuppy's is not good. If they were good, it would be a priorty that the people they scammed get their money back.
It would be like me going to a meeting with people I know scammed me. I never want to see them again. I would be afraid my reaction would not be civil.
Cuppys Depositors did not attend
What disenfranchised franchise got numerous invitations???
What depositor got numerous invitations????
They must have overlooked me and every other emptyhanded depositor I know when they sent out those invitations.
From what I've read it would have only added insult to injury.
Don, can you identify which depositors and which frachisees were
cordially invited to the event?
Get a grip!
They didn't attend because they understood that going there would produce nothing. If refunds were available, they would have been provided without attendance at the AAFD annual picnic. Free lawyers are worth what you pay 'em. Aint nothing free!
A suggestion that the plane ticket would have put $ 30,000 in anyone's pocket is sheer nonsense.It's kinda like Hillarious Clintstone's gas tax break bullshit. Until you said that, I thought you were really bright.--
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Re: Cuppy's Depositors
Let's see, there was a 'gag' order put in place on people that signed the agreement. Did Cuppy's waive that? Also, these people are out $30k+, so spending more money to travel to some organizations meeting that is clearly on the side of Cuppy's would've really done nothing. The AAFD is a joke, plain and simple.
AAFD
I should not be so amazed that so many can be seemingly "experts" on a subject they are so obviously "ignorant" about. Not one of the comments posted in association with this AAFD/Cuppy's thing has shown that they understand or know what they are talking about with respect to the AAFD. Making inuendos to tarnish the reputation of anyone is easy to do but researching, getting facts and then agreeing or disagreeing takes more effort and obviously the writers of these comments have not had the time to do so. If any one of the individuals trashing the AAFD can even recite the processes to gain a Fair Franchising Seal or Accredited Contract, I would certainly like to know. If you don't know the difference, how can you speak to it's benefit or if there even is one? Free speach is a wonderful thing but it always gives opportunities for those who know little to say much and unfortunately in the process, impune the integrity of someone who has given their all in their passion for providing an environment where franchisees have their voice count. Just to set the record straight, if not for the AAFD those Cuppy's franchisees would never have had the right to a refund!
Where is the reporting of the good that the AAFD has done? Where is the reporting of the franchisees that are happy with their agreement and thier franchisor because of the AAFD's effort in setting those standards that now are beneficial to all? Where is the fairness in franchising? Seems to me it would start with people being fair in their assessments of situations and to research before you speak; get your facts straight and then let people decide which side they fall on. You've gotten a raw deal? Maybe because it's the rule of "What goes around, comes around".
Methinks someone's cupping their meds...
If any one of the individuals trashing the AAFD can even recite the processes to gain a Fair Franchising Seal or Accredited Contract, I would certainly like to know. Me too. Maybe if it were set to music... like the hokey pokey...
Where is... the good that the AAFD has done? Where is the reporting of the franchisees that are happy with their agreement and thier franchisor because of the AAFD's effort in setting those standards that now are beneficial to all? Where is the fairness in franchising? Good questions. Really good questions. Where are all the happy Cuppy's Coffee franchise owners?
Just to set the record straight, if not for the AAFD those Cuppy's franchisees would never have had the right to a refund! Thanks for setting the record straight.... Got to go (backing slowly toward the door) I'm wanted back on Earth now...
One example...
Sean Kelly writes:
The AAFD's involvement in my franchise system, Meineke, has been instrumental in fostering an environment between franchisor and franchisee that has resulted in over 75% of our franchisees providing a favorable response when asked recently about their relationship with the franchisor. The AAFD's assistance has allowed our independent dealer's association to grow and offer many benefits to our membership that we otherwise could not have which has strengthened our position and voice. The involvement of individuals from both the franchisee and franchisor side of the equation in the AAFD has exposed both sides to the concept of fair franchising and provided us with benchmarks to guage our progress towards a goal of promoting our system to the benefit of all concerned.
So please count Meineke as one example of where the AAFD has facilitated improvements in a franchise system that have benefited the franchisor and franchisees alike.
AAFD
The truth is the uneducated general public doesn't know the difference between the Franchise Seal of Approval or the Accredited Contract Status. I know, I know, the uneducated have no business entering into a franchise agreement! This point can be and has been discussed at length on this forum. It is blantantly dishonest for the organization who presented the award (AAFD) and the organization who received the award (Cuppy's) and both know the difference between the two to misrepresent the award. Consider this passage taken from the Cuppy's Coffee and More website:
Cuppy's Coffee Smoothies & More receives AAFD Accreditation!
Cuppy's franchise agreement earned a nearly perfect score of 99.5% conformity with the AAFD Fair Franchising Standards, the highest grade ever achieved!
The American Association of Franchisees and Dealers (AAFD) is a national non-profit trade association that is dedicated to help define and support fair franchising practices applied by franchisors.
Cuppy's Coffee Smoothies & More has earned the highest score ever achieved by a franchisor for compliance. The year old franchise takes pride in its franchising agreement and believes that treating franchisees as partners attributes to its success.
According to the AAFD, "Cuppy's Coffee has committed itself to a collaborative franchise culture that adopts high standards of mutual respect between franchisor and franchisees."
It is with this approach we are able to provide a franchise system equally beneficial to us, the franchisor, as well as the franchisee.
Read more here: The AAFD Awards Cuppy's Coffee Franchise with Contract Accreditation (End of Excerpt)
Note in particular Paragraph 2,:
The American Association of Franchisees and Dealers (AAFD) is a national non-profit trade association that is dedicated to help define and support fair franchising practices applied by franchisors.
What do the words "practices applied" imply? It implies to me that this Franchise actually operates by some sort of standard endorsed by the AAFD.
It is the hook that adds some sort of credibility and trustworthiness to the potential franchisee. It is used to decieve. The AAFD has not asked that this language be removed from Cuppy's website because it is misleading. In fact the AAFD is just as dishonest for allowing it.
It is rumored that Mr. Bob Purvin actually spent the days leading up to their annual conference at Cuppy's corporate headquarters in Florida. Obviously from the large role Cuppy's has played in the opening of the AAFD conference, his visit to Cuppy's was not to scold them for their questionable behavior.
The sudden sale of Cuppy's over a weekend and a few beers for an undisclosed amount to Fransnergy is suspect I suspect that Robert Morgan's business practices were under investigation by those with more authority than the AAFD. I wouldn't be surprised if the real reason they are putting a moratorium on accepting new franchising is because they have been handed a cease and desist order. Bob Pruvin has tainted himself by the company he keeps.
Oye Pendejo!
There is a discernible difference between what people say they are about and the realities of it all.
In the instance of the AAFD, that difference is demonstrated by the facts that: (1) Despite their claim to be advocates for "fair" franchising,they have changed nothing and accomplished nothing other than confering awards on the bozos who pretend that they have merit. They don't; and (2) If someone pays some kind of formalistic lip service to their so called agenda (like Cuppys), they lack the ability to see that it is just bullshit and insincerity - and they then confer status and awards upon any miscreant who manipulates them.
It is ridiculous to get worked up/upset about the AAFD, because it is just pretense and not substance. It is a chatters' club and nothing more. Appropriately it is in California, near Disneyland.--
Get a life! These are all just phony theoreticians. They accomplish nothing and signify nothing. The AAFD is what you get for chump change.
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Spin Spin Spin...
Fact: The AAFD is a national non-profit trade association dedicated to defining and promoting Total Quality Franchising practices.
Would you consider what Cuppy's has done lately to be in compliance with these practices? If not, why would you honor that franchise with some time at the podium during one of the AAFD marquee events of the year?
Don't try to spin the difference between the Franchise Seal of Approval and the Accredited Contract status -- i personally don't know what the difference is and i really don't care. If you continue to associate yourself with slime after recognizing the slime for what it is, then you lose credibility. That's typically how it works in society. Doesn't matter if you mingle with other reputable folks, they'll remember you for mucking around with the slimy ones -- as it should be.
Gee, I hope that clears things up for you.
AAFD
I am disappointed to see such a potentially useful blog site turn into such a waste of internet space. Cuppy's received accredited contract status...NOT THE FAIR FRANCHISING SEAL! If you are going to represent yourself as a credible source make sure you familiarize yourself with the FACTS. I encourage and invite anyone who has enough spare time to see how many synonyms for "ridiculous" they use in one blog to make better use of their time and educate yourself on the AAFD, the Fair Franchising Seal and AAFD Accredited Contracts.
Hair splitting is not helpful
Accredited franchising status - fair franchising seal - it's all an indistinguishable morass of nonsense.
Which Brass Bob award you get is beside the point.The fact is that a real bad orgabnization received some form of accreditatrion from an organization that claims it is serving a positive purppose in vetting franchises.
--
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Bad Award?
Richard writes: "The fact is that a real bad orgabnization received some form of accreditatrion from an organization that claims it is serving a positive purppose in vetting franchises."
That is a fair comment.
We will have to do better. I have some ideas about how we can do that.
But there is no doubt that had the subcommittee known about the extent of the previous deposit problem, we would have insisted on escrowing the deposits as a requirement for this franchise system's accreditation.
Ironically, this would have solved a great deal of problems and would have been accepted by the franchisor.
Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News
AAFD conference and Cuppy's.
The recent reported events coming out of the AAFD's Conference tells me all i need to know about the AAFD.
Cuppy's is a den of thieves, and the AAFD continues to invite them into their house.
You can split hairs all you want to try and make the elephant in the room go away but it's not going anywhere.
I totally agree- bad franchise
You are 100% correct. I don't know why they sit on here and have other people sit on here trying to defend themselves. If they cared about the franchisees to begin with- they would not be the worst voted franchise out there
A Joke
This is all such a joke. I believe the person below that stated if they are trying to focus on the franchisees, why are they attending a meeting, if they should already have credibility with the AAFD? Pointless. I have never seen a company with so many operational errors the first couple of years of existance. Does anyone there have a degree or operation skills at all?
Are you kidding me, did Cuppy's get an award fter admitting they were in violation of the AAFD's standards. I guess they are giving them out left and right. If that is the case, they should take it off their website, because anyone can get one, so why are you so proud? I really can't waste anymore time looking at comments about this lame franchise- NEXT!
AAFD
As a prospective Zee and new to the franchising world, it will be interesting to see how the Cuppy's / AAFD situation plays out.
It has been extremely difficult to find non sales BS information regarding any franchise system. I found the AAFD, which, at first glance, seemed to be a fair arbiter of determining the viability and fairness of a franchise. As I've watched from afar for a little while now, it is becoming evident to me that there really are no truly objective advocates for Zees or prospective Zees. In fact, the AAFD may be the most dangerous of all of the sales organizations (if that's what they truly are. I'm still trying to figure out if they're an advocate or a PR machine). The AAFD gives a false sense of security that a franchise they give their gold seal of approval to is a good franchise.
At least the million sites like Entrepreneur and the swarm of franchise sales organizations are obvious.
The AAFD has already lost a lot of credibility with me. They need to reconsider their charter, if they are truly an advocate. Viability should be a major criteria. If a franchise systems' Zees are failing (as defined by real world standards for failure, not the ridiculous nearly unattainable failure definition Q uses) at or above an industry average, then they shouldn't get AAFD approval.
If the AAFD is going to promote itself as the beacon of truth in franchising among the fog of sales BS, it needs to tighten up it's act. Only viable, continually performing franchise systems with fair agreements and high Zee satisfaction should get the gold seal. Anything less doesn't really help a prospect make a proper decision.
The franchise world has a big problem. The economy sucks, the stupid people can't tap their home equity anymore and the people who are smart and have money outside of their home are going to research extensively before buying a franchise. While doing my research, I see BIG GIANT RED FLAGS all over the place (regarding franchising in general). Let alone trying to get good information regarding a specific franchise system.
It's been eye opening and quite ridiculous. No wonder so many Zees fail. It appears a huge percentage of the franchises are a scam, like a giant ponzi scheme. There appear to be some good ones, but then there are a myriad of other factors that can doom a good system as well. It seems to be quite a roll of the dice to lock into a franchise agreement (which most appear to be pretty one sided), strap on a huge lease commitment, hire a bunch of low wage employees and then send off 8 to 13 percent of the money to corporate. All with your behind on the line, while corporate makes money no matter what happens to you. You fail, they resell the location to another idjut, and the cycle continues.
I guess I've talked myself out of being a Zee. What I've learned is, you've got to be a Zor in this game. Come up with a catchy business concept that the masses will buy into, develop a slick sales and marketing campaign, hire up some attorneys to package up the legal and then sell the sh@@ out of it. Doesn't matter if the Zee will make any money or not. If a few do, great, more testimonials. If they don't, just keep pumpin' out the PR and play on people's hopes and dreams. There are a lot of suckers at the base of the pyramid and there are always going to be people chasing "the American dream." It's like shooting fish in a barrel.
One more observation: it's quite entertaining reading the posts of the attorneys hovering around this site like vulchers waiting for someone to pay them for due diligence or to sue their Zor. Piece of advice to the idjuts out there in franchise land: you don't need an attorney to make your decision. Read the freakin' FDD. Your attorney can't change it one bit. The ones I've read spell out pretty clearly that the Zor is the f'or and you are the f'ee (rhymes with duck if you can't fill in the blanks). From what I've learned, the attorney will hedge, much like a stock broker, making sure to balance things out without giving a decisive recommendation (in most cases). They'll talk you through it, meter running, and let you make your own decision, while CYA'ing for the duration so you've been properly warned of the risks when making your decision. They'll give you advice you can get by reading up on your own and then send you a large bill. If you're looking for someone to tell you "this is a good franchise, buy it" that's not what you're going to get. The benefit you may get is some help in eliminating the worst options, but again, you should be able to figure it out yourself if you just read the FDD's which are written in pretty plain English. Now, if you decide to sue your Zor, well then, you'll get some help there. Attorneys are good at suing. Just go contingent. If they won't, then you probably don't have a very strong case.
Now, don't get me wrong, there are many who make an awful lot of money as Zees. But, that's like saying that there are many who make an awful lot of money as professional athletes or rock stars. For every highly successful Zee, there appears to be throngs of ruined ones littering our country's landscape.
I'm gonna keep searching, but boy the franchise industry needs more truth and transparency. The info highway has 10 lanes going in one direction, in favor of the Zors, and a little dirt path in the other direction, for the prospective Zees. That's not good. The AAFD, it appears, could be the beacon to help us through the fog, but they'll have to make some serious changes, IMO, or they'll steer more ships into the rocks.
Truth and transparency
in the world of franchising? People need to fully understand their UFOC/FDD. You are doing the right thing studying the world of franchising which many do not do. To really understand their disclosures you have to understand the franchising world. Makes a big difference.
Why do you thing the AAFD is dangerous? Is it they promote franchising with the statement of fair business practices?
The only way to get transparency in franchising is work in the choice of business for 6 months. (This is what Webster, Solomon and many of the people here on BMM) suggest.
RE: Truth and transparency
I'm not sure if the AAFD is dangerous. I can't figure out if they are a PR machine put in place by the industry to sell more franchises, or if they are truly an advocate for Zees.
If they are a PR machine and not a fair arbiter, then yes, they could be dangerous in giving a prospective Zee a false sense of security when making the life-changing decision to purchase a franchise.
If they are a fair arbiter and a true advocate, then they would be extremely helpful in helping a prospective Zee make a wise choice.
The Cuppy's situation is causing me concern. I don't see how, if they are a fair arbiter, that Cuppy's gets the AAFD's backing (at least from what I've read about how many Cuppy's Zees are losing everything and then there's the whole deposit situation).
That's just my take on it.
At the AAFD meetings
Do they just promote franchising? Is there no talk about the problems in franchising? I have never been a part of something like this. I am interested. Is it just a social gathering?
A false sense of security- this is one of the sales techniques they use to reel you in.
I believe good zors would be honest and tell their zees what they need to do to make an educated decision to sign or not to sign.
Hopefully,
the fate of Cuppy's hasn't already been determined by the AAFD before the standards committee meets. I'll reserve judgement until after the standards committee meets.
Allow me to get this straight...
Frankly, I was shocked to learn that anyone from Cuppys was present at this conference.
This is what I know from my readings and research about Cuppys:
A) There are multiple families tonight who are on the cusp of losing their homes and/or filing for bankruptcy due to the fact that their Cuppy's deposit has not been refunded.
B) Pretty much every Cuppys franchisee is struggling for survival. The new owner said as much just last week - and has committed to focusing all resources on existing center profitability.
C) Multiple members of Cuppy's new ownership group are in Virginia attending a conference – and are up on stage singing and delivering mea culpa speeches.
D) They are attending a conference of a group which supposedly focuses on "fair franchising" standards...with a standards compass admittedly fixated on the SALES PROCESS and FRANCHISE AGREEMENTS versus ongoing franchise relations - as decried countless times on these boards by the AAFD leadership.
If Cuppy's new CEO is indeed a man of his word (focused on settling the outstanding refund issue and existing unit profitability) and AAFD is truly interested in promoting fair franchising then:
1. Why in the world would anyone at Cuppys spend a single dollar or a minute of their time attending a meeting that has absolutely nothing to do with these immediate stated needs? Sorry - "the old guys booked the flights and hotel" isn't a good enough excuse.
2. Why in the world would the AAFD provide a forum to a group which has proclaimed a moratorium on new franchise sales and franchise agreement signing? Sorry - "they paid their dues and had a table at the dinner” isn't a good enough excuse. Why wasn’t Cuppys uninvited and their fees refunded with the agreement to disperse all monies back to those awaiting their refund?
3. Why would any member of the "standards" committee spend a single moment pondering or debating Cuppy's continued inclusion as a "member in good standing"? Is this even a question to be pondered?!? Wouldn't time be better spent fixing the obviously broken system which allowed Cuppys to be designated in the first place? With what is already known, isn’t it an obvious slam dunk decision to invite Cuppy’s back for consideration only after they make good on the outstanding issues?
I admit to not knowing all of the nitty gritty - I beg someone, anyone, to point out my errors. Please explain why anyone should take the AAFD seriously as long as they continue to keep Cuppys in the fold.
Song & Dance of Cuppy's Coffee & the AAFD
Excellent post by Don and comments from Dan. As much as I appreciate the ribald humor and madcap self-parody that the AAFD & Cuppy's continue to provide (Don, please tell us what songs they sang. Even Rich Quick can't outdo these guys.), is anyone else a bit uncomfortable about what this situation is indicating about our industry?
It's incredible that a year later we should even have to point out the minimum steps that should taken immediately:
1) Cuppy's Coffee should give people back their money. This includes anyone still owed from Java Jo'z. If they have to set up a payment plan, fine, but they should pay them back in full, plus interest. No bogus deductions. No gag orders to keep them from sharing whether the payments are being made. No "We're not responsible for Morg Morgan when he was wearing his Java Jo'z golf cap" If Dale Nabors is the stand-up guy we hope he is, it's time for him to stand up. I'll be the first to praise him for making things right.
Criston Menz ($35,900) and Robyn Rivera ($30,000) have documented their current runaround in interviews on UnhappyFranchisee.com. Another couple from CA (Lina & Lee - $35,900) have left a comment, and I'm sure Dale has a list of how many others are out there (Just look in Morg's filing cabinet under Whoopee! Free Money!). This is happening now, on Dale's watch.
2) Cuppy's Coffee should declare the same policy for the people who have yet to come forward. There are undoubtedly more Cristons, Robyns and Linas who gave deposits in 2007 who haven't yet realized what they've stepped in.
3) Elite/Cuppy's/Medina should not take deposits until a franchisee has financing secured and a location lined up. If deposits are collected, they should use a 3rd party escrow and have payouts at particular benchmarks.
4) The AAFD should insitute procedures that protect the interests not only of unborn franchisees but the credibility and investments of time and money made by their franchisor, franchisee, and professional members. One would think that non-profit status would require procedures for implementation of the stated mission so that it was not, simply, a platform for one man to further the for-profit interests of his cronies... even if said cronies are needed to fill in that difficult baritone harmony at the banquet.
4) If the AAFD has changed its mission to serve the interests of those who pinky-swear they're gonna be really, really fair this year, and allow them to use the AAFD logo despite their admitted noncompliance, Mr. Purvin should notify the current AAFD members before they continue to invest their time, money and professional credibility.
Perhaps a name change would be a good start. How about: AAFD: Association for the Advancement of Fraud & Deception?
Our well-intentioned blogging and exposing of misdeeds and miscreants may have an unintended negative consequence. If the naughty boys are given awards, rather than being censured, what does that say about franchising and the ethics and professionalism of those associated with it? Even pirates, the Mafia and Hell's Angels have codes of ethics and rules of conduct, guys.
Even the shadowy figures among us have a vested interest in saying enough's enough!
Sean Kelly
seankelly[at]ideafarm.net
Franchise Pick
I'm tired of dancing
I would not mind dancing so much if the music were better selected. I, Criston Menz, am technically a Cuppy's franchisee as is Robyn and Lina. I do not see that we are being any better taken care of in our "current" status. Now really, one might question if we are or are not a franchisee as we payed our money to different entities;Cuppy's, Elite, Medina, Java Jo'z...heck I have a check book, should I keep on writing? All kidding aside, this is an opportunity to enforce the standards that the AAFD is trying so hard to create. Even in the NFL you are given monetary penalties for unsportsman like conduct...should we borrow their rule book? How about fining Cuppy's and utilizing the fines to pay out settlements? Just a question, does Cuppy's pay to utilize the logo, AAFD? Someone is getting paid here and I can tell you it is not Robyn, Lina or myself.
"Check, please...I am outa here."
Money??? Anyone??
Nabors admitted, "In my opinion, we [Cuppy's] weren't living up to AAFD standards. Cuppy's had a desire to. I'm here tonight to say that we are going to commit to living up to the AAFD fair franchising standards."
Sounding very similar to commitments made at the AAFD conference in Dallas last year where Cuppy's president Doug Hibbing and his boss's wife, Mrs. Morgan, said that they were honored and that they would change company practices to meet AAFD standards, now Hibbing's new boss, Mr. Nabors says, "Next year we hope our franchise review and our franchisees say we deserve to be here."
After comments like this from Cuppy's themselves should we ask who is really getting the money being stolen from peoples pockets????
Hey!!! I have an idea... I would like to get paid, oh say $30,000. Robyn Rivera is my name and my husband, Corey, and I have been playing their song and dance for two years, only to see they are being rewarded for their quick feet. Seems the AAFD and the Oscars have alot in common, both give out awards for no apparent reason.
It doesn't matter if they are Java Joz, Cuppy's, Elite..they are the same. It stands to reason that if a company claims to have no ties with its past than at least be smart enough to change your address, phone number, LOGO, products, people working for you, Hell anything.
This song and dance isn't cheap not to me, Criston or anyone else who has had the misfourtune of coming across Cuppy's.
I am with Criston, Money...Anyone???? Anyone????
Unhappy
Hey AAFD why don't you take a look at the real world and see what is REALLY going on....UnhappyFranchisee.com
People are fed up, mad and want justice to be served. Giving praise for robbing the stage coach isn't good work. It only produces unhappy franchisees....UnhappyFranchisee.com
Oh please. Gimme a break!
I am amazed that you, of all people, have any expectations that the AAFD represents significant substance in franchising.
Alvin and the Chipmunks are and have always been absolutely useless pretenders. They are to franchising as FEMA is to disaster relief.
If the AAFD gives its "awards" (what a joke that is!) to miscreants, that is precisely in character and revealing of what the AAFD is really all about - ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
FORGETABOUTIT! The AAFD is and always will be simply ridiculous.--
Richard Solomon, FranchiseRemedies.com, has over 45 years experience with franchise litigation and crisis management. He is a graduate of The Citadel and The University of Michigan Law School
Last ride at Disneyland...
I know...
I guess I knew, deep down, that my vision of a violent coup, with the ex-presidente and supporters barricading themselves in the Cuppy's Suite with piles of golf bags, logoed promotional products and boxes of accredited contracts, was not premonition.
Deep down inside, I knew that Don Sniegowski, Michael Webster and Paul Steinberg would not put on the fatigues and Fidel Castro beards I had sent to their hotel rooms (though they probably smoked the cigars). It just was a darn fine fantasy while it lasted...
Viva la revolucion!
Sean Kelly
seankelly@ideafarm.net
Franchise Pick
Why hire an attorney for due diligence?
If I'm interested in purchasing a franchise, why should I hire a franchise attorney during the due diligence process?
What can you tell me that I can't figure out on my own from reading the FDD's carefully? Can you give specific and decisive recommendations on which franchise to buy? Can you get a Zor to modify their Franchise Agreement? How much does a typical due diligence scenario cost? Give me a real world example (you can change the names to protect the innocent) of how you've helped a prospective Zee make a wise decision on which franchise to buy, and how, years later, they are successful (if that has occurred in your experience). What percentage of Zees who have hired you for due diligence have gone on to succeed in the last 5 to 10 years? (By success, I mean turning a profit after two years in biz and staying profitable and in business to date).
I'm not asking rhetorically, I have some presuppositions and some attorney feedback, but want to hear another experienced franchise attorney's answers before I can make an informed decision on whether to poney up the dough and hire one.
We all have read about the Cuppy's zee's problems
Everyone on BMM has written things like zees never do anything.
Yes I believe more Cuppy zee's should of been at that meeting and dicussing their many problems.
All I can speak is from my personal experience and talking to many hurt zees in other systems.
It is hard for people to understand why people do things after being hurt from loss, unless you have been there.
Many whom are hurt zees feel no hope or lost their faith in their fellow human beings. Their positive attitude has been deminished. They are afraid of people. When someone has hurt your family monetary and you emotionally you do not trust your judgement. You have to rebuild you confidence to even mingle with people . So how can they be open about their problems? No one wants to hear it do they? Plus no one cares.
The monetary hurt is nothing compared to the emotional scares that are created. If you recently been hurt the wound is open and you are still bleeding. There is no band aide for emotional wounds.
I can understand why no one from Cuppy's spend a single moment pondering or debating Cuppy's continued inclusion as a as "member in good standing." Yes their system is broken but the people themselves are broken. Many people have an attitude if we do not talk about it, things will get better and the problems will go away.