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The UPS Store, Tales of Gore

Stories of ownership failure, carnage and regrets about The UPS Store (TUPSS), formerly known as Mail Boxes Etc. OH, and the rebuttals to those horror stories too.

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I'd be satisfied Part II

If I could GIVE my UPS Store away !!!!

Infamous Amos MBE

With him it is always someone elses fault. Look at all the cronies he brought to MBE including his daughter. David B. was beloved by Jim and then dismissed. I read where Jim described him in one of his books with accolades concerning his Nam service as a fighter piolt. He was never even in the service, did not hold the degrees he claimed and was paid a huge severance. I guess we should just hire people in key positions with no background checks L/N? L.L. was the same an old Marine pal who was brought in an executive position. He was the next best thing to sliced butter until there was a problem. Heather said he was dissmissed (confidential) for a professional conduct reason. He was paid a huge severance. Tom same old thing. I believe it is tougher to get a job a 7/11 than at MBE during the Amos regime. UPS was smart to buy the system. USOP stock had been taken off the big board. What did he think that UPS intended to do with the system, the problem is that the franchisee had no recourse other than go with the plan. Remember Las Vagas when it was announced and how great everything was going to be. Hey loved the POS system too. Tony made a huge amount of money when the the company was sold. He was known for treating the franchisee right and I believe he garnered more respect then Amos ever will. You wont find all the crap and lawsuits if you google his name. I will never invole myself in another franchise and would advise anyone to avoid Amos and company. Beware of false prophets.

You want to compare *3*

You want to compare *3* against ALL those that are listed as transferring or out of biz?????



Found in the bloodbath

Found in the bloodbath above:

IFA Investments Inc The UPS Store #4404



Dont be surprised

If COSTCO starts to sell "DISCOUNTED UPS Stores" at COSTCO'S..Considering the # of failed UPS Stores

UPS Store and Jim Amos ------Ego and Faith

It just takes great ego and faith in God and faith in the stupidity of franchisee prospects who will pay to float and try to prove your concepts, and you can become an IFA legend. IFA legends are always looking for new ZOR ways to make money for themselves in and out of the country. All franchisors are looking for the new McDonald's! --the new way to make millions ---the new way to attract private equity investors. Whether these be Christian Capitalists, or Jewish Capitalists, or Hindu Capitalists, or Islamic Capitalists, or just secular Capitalists, the nature of franchising that depends on the labor and venture capital of franchisees, also depends upon disguising the risk and the "con" involved in the "art" of the deal.

It also takes only a UFOC and a killer franchise agreement and franchisors have immunity under the law for all except a little negligent misrepresentation now and then---well, only twice. I believe, for Mr. Amos, who settled out of court on one of them, as indicated on Blue Mau Mau. Please note that Sona is on the SBA Registry, as are the UPS Store, the Coffee Beanery, Quiznos, and others who have very high failure rates of first-generation franchisees.

Please read the Sona Comments by Mr. Coady on Blue Mau Mau who did win his arbitration that Sona then tried to spin as a success for the franchisor. Sona, of course, did the usual ZOR thing, and counter charged for millions of dollars, all of which the arbiter denied.

It is because prospects can't believe that their government would license the existing state of franchising with UFOC's, and because nice human beings have faith in human nature and deal themselves in good faith, that they become victims of predator franchisors.

Mr. Coady thought he did due diligence and he is a very well educated and well placed American who has held executive positions in the Corporate World. He had the courage to tell the Sona story here on Blue Mau Mau to help others and to promote change. I believe that the Coady's indicated that it was their personal association with Mr. Amos and their knowledge that he was a good Christian man and a former high official in the IFA that put them off guard, perhaps!


thanks for the advice

yes my store is new.i bought it thru my home equity credit.
bad investment on our part.we were in the dark from day one.
picking out a spot was a disaster.i will seek an attorney thank you.

UPS Store disguises unviable business plan

Yes! Unfortunately, with the help of the FTC and disclosure Rules and practice, UPS can hide the unprofitability of the stores behind the famous brand name of the multi-billion dollar company who bought a franchisor to maximize their profits through the capture of cheap labor and capital of middle-class people looking for a job and income.

These big corporations know that the status quo of the law surrounding franchising gives them a blank check and they are prone to write big checks in their own favor.

Anyone who wants to go into the Postal - Shipping Business would do much better with the little guys like Goin Postal because of the lowered startup costs and royalty arrangement and record of achievement of their first owners.

But, from the beginning of regulation in the late 70's, the big boys didn't want any competition within concept-sectors that would result in competition to recruit potential franchisees and this is another reason why potential franchisees get no earnings claims or really effective information upon which to do their due diligence cvoncerning risk and profitability.


Don't make the same mistake too many others have realized. RUN - Run anywhere but The UPS Store. Too many have lost everything, do not let yourself become one of them. The UPS Store is a money pit!
Drop-Off volumes are going through the roof while stores are closing across the country - RUN - put your money in cans buried in the backyard - you'll be glad you did.

UPS is the single largest competor of The UPS Store & yet they own the franchise..........?
We are giving away business daily without any return - Please learn from our experience - RUN

message to Mikey

It's interesting how quiet Mikey has been to the UPS shareholders about the huge problems and law suits that have been growing against the UPS Store's failed business model. Nothing like honesty in BIG BUSINESS!!!!!!

Barbara Jorgensen's picture

I don't believe

telling the truth about what's going on in the franchise world is not whining. I am not anti-franchising. If our zor had not lied about so much I would talking about the good things. I don't believe our zor ever believed we were going to succeed. That's what I call a bad zor. Of course I do take the responsibility for allowing them lie. But misrepresentations in any field of business should be acknowledged and shouted to the whole world. So the honest person who is ethical can make an educated decision.

I have talked to many from my own franchise on this matter. Yes they believe we allowed them to lie. Doesn't excuse them from their lies.

Rich Hallibrin I believe was

Rich Hallibrin I believe was the management person from MBE that made that statement. The reality of it is, there is no additional monitary help or "break" that MBE Corporate offers.



UPS Store Franchise

I have over 35 years of business experience. As on owner of a UPS store franchise I can honestly say I have never dealth with a more dishonest, deceitful company than UPS. If anyone is even remotely considering the purchase of a UPS store franchise you are about to make possibly the greatest financial mistake of your life. These stores are in existance for one reason, the make money for UPS on the hard work and sweat of the unsuspecting franchisees. UPS will rake in the profits while you struggle to make ends meet. This is the norm, not the exception.

UPS Drop Off's ----hazardous waste

Thanks MOM for straightening this out. In addition to all of the matters above, the telephone rings constantly in these stores and most of the public think YOU ARE UPS and don't understand if you can't spend a long time on the phone with them trying to solve their problems for them.
I often wonder if UPS didn't think of the liability for Hazardous Materials when they decided to buy MBE-UPS, knowing that the individual store owners would bear the liability. This, afterall, was post 9-11-01, that terrible day when the world changed forever.

Zees ARE idiots!

Franchisor salesmen should tell franchisees that they won't break even for 3 to 5 years.

Then the salesman should tell the franchisee that Purvin, Shane, Bates, etc have shown that a majority of new franchisors don't even last 5 years.

The salesman should give the IFA sales pitch about how franchisees are paying for a "proven" system.

As to the UPS Store: again, heed the wisdom of FRANMASTER. The reason all those UPS franchisees are losing their collective shirt is not because the system is flawed, it is because the UPS franchisees are idiots.

And anyone who disagrees with FRANMASTER about UPS franchisees being idiots should consider that the franchisees bought the franchise in the first place-- who but an idiot would do that?

The smart franchisor not only convinced the franchisee to buy, but has been smart enough to convince state regulators that a franchisor who keeps their thumb on the scale is not defrauding the citizenry.

UPS franchisor is SMART.

It is the UPS franchisees that are IDIOTS.

Congers, NY UPS

Are you David from UPS Congers, NY.

That was a good movie, Deliverance! Hope you are okay and are in one of The UPS Stores that is making money.

UPS to sponsor TV

UPS Store franchise headquarters has just announce it will sponsor the upcoming season of The Biggest Loser. Contestants won't actually have to diet anymore. Instead, they will have to tinker with the weighing scale without getting caught.



Paul Steinberg's picture

All in the spelling

Don't worry about language being censored. At least till this summer, you can still inquire whether a prospect has been disclosed by asking "UFOC'd by the franchisor yet?"

I think the FTC changed the name because they got tired of the double entendres. 

One good UPS Laser goes a LONG way !

When things like packages are out of shape, one good UPS Laser goes a "long" way to increasing corporate profits! Huh! That's "the long and the short" of it and who wins and who loses and gets the short end?
We already know the answer to this. Some get laser--d and some get taser--d! Ouch!

Carman you're up!

Carman is the resident wailing former UPS Store franchisee.

Manipulation of Stock Options UPS

Would this amount to a manipulation of the market and isn't this prohibited by the SEC?

Paul Steinberg's picture

UPS success

I have heard of UPS stores near college campuses which do well. And in some urban areas they get decent traffic from people that use the store in lieu of a PO box; the flip side is that those tend to be areas with pricey rents.

One thing which has never been explained to me is why people are blaming UPS rather than the business model, since the UPS model doesn't appear very different from the MBE model which preceeded it. 

Paul Steinberg
Franchisee Attorney, New York City, Ph: 212-529-5400

Why a Failure?

The University is looking at a UPS store. What was the primary reason for failure? Several reasons? Please share.
Ron W.

FranSynergy's picture

UPS Zee : Streess Ball!!


It has been nearly a month since I found and posted the ad, my Alzheimers is kicking in prematurely and I can not recall where it came from with 100% certainty. 

With that said I'm 99.49% certain that it was in the Franchise Section of  The ad is no longer there, however there is an ad of the same size, which causes me to believe that it was probably once there.  Perhaps someone over at the UPS MARKETING Department reads Bluemaumau.

Sorry I can't be of more help.  No one has yet touched on the same humor which I saw in the ad, or perhaps like me no one wants to say --- what I chose not to say -- about the Big Hand of UPS having the UPS STORE Ball in their hands --- just waiting to SQUEEZE! 

Best of luck to you UPS guest, visit often and participate regularly!

Believe & Succeed,
FranSynergy, Inc.
Synergizing Franchising!

Bob Frankman's picture

UPS Squeezing TUPSS-Zee

I may not always agree with what is written here but your piece certainly pulled me in to understand the stress of being a franchisee squeezed by UPS. I hope you and others can turn the tables in having TUPSS franchisees be able to squeeze UPS balls. (Hmmm. Did that come out right?)

There are some great quotes from your comment. My favorite is this:

"I hate it when those stores who do well tell others and are spokesmen for the sale of new stores; that this is a great business to be in. If you are a business person, you know that location is everything and some luck thrown in always helps. It is always a gamble and even the best researchers didn't see these dead end stores coming."

In other words, there by the grace of God go I, despite how brilliant and skilled I might think I am. Starting and maintaining a business is a gamble.

Great post. Thanks.

Bob Frankman's picture

Internet Jargon

Need to brush up on my Internet jargon. It took me a full minute to figure out what the -LMAO part of your title "ROTFLMAO" meant.

I'm still such a noob to the Net.

Discrepancy in number of The UPS Stores

Does anyone really know how many The UPS Stores are standing out there, and does anyone really know how many are still standing only because they bought a discounted store at 95% off of the original owner's investment?
Are these MBE-UPS stores that were bought at bargain prices also in trouble and unprofitable?
Why is it called "Churning"? Woudn't "PIGgy Backing" be a more accurate description?

FranSynergy's picture

Added Profit Center

Oh you might be right, but a lot of folks would just take the idea and run with it.
Business Planning is included in our Franchise Service Package. We also offer 3 differnt stand alone Business Planning packages to Franchise Candidates who are not yet a subscriber to the Franchise Service Package. The stand alone Business Planning packages range in price from $99 to $799. One of the little excercises we do here all the time is brainstorm ways to create new profit centers in various SIC codes. We have the 85 SIC codes which currently franchise written on cards, we randomly draw a card and then try to come up with areas which are not being served which could be. We keep a journal for each SIC code, and then when we are working with someone withing that SIC code, we go to the journal for ideas. That's how this particular idea came about, and we've held on to it, and shared it with 2 or 3. The first one into a geographical market has a strong edge, because you contract the business within that market for this FREE money saving concept, and then earn money by saving the business money. If your knowledgable about mailing services you can probably take that hint and come real close to figure out what it is and how it would work.

Believe & Succeed,
FranSynergy, Inc.
Synergizing Franchising!

reward Dale?

UPS will simply steal the idea and it will end up costing Dale $$$$$$! LOL!

FranSynergy's picture


It works for me, click on the link, scroll down to THE UPS STORE 2007, the UFOC is then divided into sections which seem to download just fine.

If you want the entire file - and if Mr. BlueMaumau does not put it up as an entire document, send me an email address via BMM email or and I'll reply by sending it to you.  I've got it as an efile. 

Believe & Succeed,
FranSynergy, Inc.
Synergizing Franchising!

Tinker's picture

He was heavily involved in negotiating

the new Meineke franchise agreement after they lost their record breaking lawsuit.  I've spoken with him some time back and his expertise and experience in the franchise industry is very well known.  He has been recommended by several people and organizations during this Meineke fiasco.  My fondest referral was in regard to the AAFD's justification for having a franchisor on the board of this supposed franchisee organization (Meineke, again).   They actually stated that they 'needed' a franchisor on the board to 'counter the gung-ho Michael Hankes'.  I don't buy that as necessarily a 'good' thing for a franchisee organization to need, but that's what he said.  For me, it was yet another star for Hanke's.

What some call fanaticism, others call passion

What some call disgruntled complaints, others call righteous indignation.

Multi-billion dollar Companies and the Law FOC

We have to hope that even multi-billion dollar Companies like UPS are subject to the law. We know, of course, that we don't stand equal before the law with these huge corporations because money seems to be the great de-equalizer in the process.
If UPS has 56 different suits in the litigation section, how many actions do they have in mediation and arbitration. Are the mediation and arbitrations also disclosed in the UFOC's under disclosure laws?
When these big corporations settle out of court, is this disclosed in the UFOC's?


Franmaster writes:

"But give an idiot a million dollars and you still have an idiot --- and in short time you'll once again have a broke idiot!"

I wonder if he is speaking from experience because he doesn't know squat about franchises.

Simple Answer

'If not, FranData, together with the franchisors, is committing a kind of constructive fraud on the public and the banks, are they not?'

No and really stop making things up. 

michael webster's picture

Insanity and UPS

" recognize that it is insane to continue to do what you've been doing and to expect the results to be different."

What is insane is to believe that the UPS franchisor gives a damn about individual franchisee performance.  

Michael Webster PhD LLB

Misleading Advertising Law

Franchisees, Stay Anonymous

I strongly suggest that franchisee guests DO NOT list their name or store name.



What is the cost of a UPS Franchise in 2007

Just checking the cost of a UPS Franchise in 2007. Anyone know?



ups is responsible

No one told me when I started that UPS executives were running the franchisee system soley to thier benefit.
No one told me that UPS executives would approach our business directly with less than ethical goals, in our case probabvly illegal issues.
No one told us the the co-op agreement was a sham disquised to benefit ups only. They even had the balls to put in writing to me that thier intention on the interest from accounts was never meant to be applied to the co-ops that earn it,even though in the by laws they built it clearly states that interest was to be paid and applied to any bank fees. Since no fees are ever paid they just pocket the money.
No one told me that no seperation exists between the companies. No legal or real corporate veil exist between these two entities since no decisions are made without UPS executives being involved. UPS executives directs all operations.
No one told me that all advertising was to be designed to destroy the credibility of stores, see the AT&T offer and ads.
No body told me that The UPS Stores Inc would not defend the brand against attacks by the parent company see AT&T.

BK in shreveport Ed 318-861-6014

michael webster's picture

The UPS Model

Paul,  there was a dramatic change from the MBE business model to the UPS business model.  In essence, UPS wanted to convert the UPS Franchisees into little more than drop-off centres - they would have had the best of all possible worlds: manned drop-off centres with no employees, but people who looked like UPS employees to the rest of the world.

Compare this to the co-branding strategy behind FedEx/Kinkos 

Michael Webster PhD LLB
Franchise News

The business model

Paul, UPS did change the business model. The change was supposed to be an application of the Laffer curve. Cut prices -- by cutting margins -- twenty percent and the stores will make more money due to increased package counts. It didn't happen. Package revenues have barely kept pace with rising costs. UPS, however, has been very successful in converting store-shipped packages into drop offs by competing with its UPS stores.

When faced with the failure of the business model it imposed on the stores, UPS told the stores: we're going to take away most of your shipping revenue so you better start selling copies. The stores cannot survive if UPS takes away their number one profit center.

Now our marketing committee spends all its time and money on document service and packaging promotions. UPS has made "ship" a four-letter word. That's a radical change in the business model and one that is doomed to fail.

According to the posted FOC,

According to the posted FOC, the numbers are:

Operating at
Year End
06 05 04

4,412 4,383 4,067

3 + 1,000's of others

The three UPS Franchisees listed were 3 franchisees randomly selected from the first three found when I googled ["UPS STORE" + "SCORE"].

If anything it might prove that "If and When" a franchisee properly prepares to enter into business that they greatly improve their likelihood for success.

Based on the size and age of the UPS/MBE network - one would reasonably anticipate the failures to be in the 12-hundred to 24-hundred range. The 35% failure rate quoted in this thread, if accurate, would not be considered alarming by any experienced business person.

The UPS Model can and does work, if and when the UPS Model is properly worked! After having invested in a business a franchisee will determine the success or failure rate to be acceptable or not based on their own success or failure. Before investing you can anticipate your odds to be about 50/50 and they will move up or down proportionate to your preparation.

More Lists

Here is a list of CLOSED stores. Not churned, not kept, CLOSED.
All of this information should be enough DD for ANYONE

2952 2353 2184 3823 5091 3788 2948 3870 5066 308 3467
2749 1377 3453 4746 3539 2590 1639 2595 2944 1387 5297
3641 1921 3570 1925 3044 3418 4051 2512 5139 4834 322
4012 3285 3815 3792 2645 2693 4747 4334 2015 4943 1591
3329 2705 5267 2696 2413 3049 4079 4582 4977 4653 3887
1751 2707 5395 562 2993 2984 3761 3278 332 5045 750
2196 1424 1233 3334 3638 186 5002 3004 2786 5523 2513
2429 1530 2406 2063 4251 4634 2508 1518 1485 349 2712
4351 2319 1383 237 2163 3107 291 4288 1781 4999 4383
3462 1799 2185 189 2538 3454 383 2492 5766 3992 3511
2703 807 1996 4899 3784 3765 3541 2518 5473 4677 3079
3852 1888 3094 2632 3866 3549 3895 2136 17 5439 4703
2268 3328 3711 849 1774 1295 2267 4538 543 2733 5627
2176 3050 4107 3178 4928 1589 4599 3545 5107 3658 1103
2568 2338 676 4514 4807 4615 4678 3436 1807 4484 3187
2139 1474 1142 2893 3652 1864 5101 3450 5715 4840 5014
4560 1612 1343 718 1824 3884 3740 3622 1169 642 5606
4510 3786 3119 2496 3644 2129 5302 2323 4633 4826 5795
2168 1170 3209 3935 818 4319 4191 3365 2642 3219 3151
1646 2107 3856 278 3202 3154 3431 4454 1637 5540 2837
3730 2714 4131 3753 1586 4916 3936 3192 1617 2076 4136
4130 3323 1549 3463 2400 1339 3356 2229 2611 3976 2072
702 3929 1798 2866 154 2986 4032 24 3663 3417 3231
3920 3472 4173 3013 262 2035 3198 4456 3220 3640 5349
195 2747 3869 3333 3675 498 3946 3256 5806 598 3811
3990 1026 3914 3290 52 2005 5223 3388 3036 2456 4783
1912 2417 1488 3302 2242 2008 3643 3903 3964 4947 1758
481 300 1527 2754 3020 2550 1797 5570 2148 3135 4075
242 374 3632 3539 2909 2708 2367 5640 5800 450 1529
1842 603 4245 2691 3092 2736 2428 5751 4561 5666 5531
600 780 3569 3538 3741 3394 1028 5752 4238 3546 3383
405 1832 4921 1171 3165 4209 4278 4895 5769 5621 3105
3957 4041 4986 2877 3520 5047 3544 4742 1063 5459 2782
2186 5131 5120 5079 3696 2865 1681 133 5058 2283 3153
1814 3586 1958 3542 758 1019 3870 5656 5403 3157 3695
1279 1734 2375 3767 3519 1344 2595 376 3147 1596 1276
2304 4302 5008 4922 3005 4256 2512 338 1364 625 2292
1531 4946 3297 3826 4081 553 2419 3303 2818 560 3924
4192 1300 1272 3938 2857 3947 733 3163 2768 1776 3494
690 894 2345 4474 2588 4286 2885 3576 1312 2045 2544
1175 1449 2430 1434 773 3384 4412 2805 3284 2609 3536
1724 3984 1740 3140 2409 4019 1057 3362 4726 2598 1583
4100 369 260 340 3649 2860 2743 1898 2980 2159 342
136 152 31 3967 192 3317 1956 3791 3106 2848 1478
1778 10 1447 2250 3089 1194 1718 1784 3407 2911 2087
2097 37 686 1605 3817 3124 2502 198 2207 2191 416
831 419 164 3073 125 4447 1771 2751 3482 1808 3664
2410 817 1004 1790 1852 2858 3634 2278 2177 1305 3181
989 2260 2274 891 1880 4438 3665 2142 3266 2248 124
2960 3180 2140 3988 1087 229 3881 3889 2884 2396 2275
2182 3813 3158 4524 4499 3807 1960 2009 3830 4973 3803
3028 2934 3537 495 3265 2373 1922 2497 3892 1011 2824
2684 4328 1459 489 2453 2629 2581 3321 700 2533 3782
1677 5198 2351 4154 970 3021 1467 4003 1385 2692 3527
2013 2829 2023 1392 4554 1446 4124 146 3366 4195 2138
19 2977 4183 3581 200 2312 3931 3473 3896 931 2868
215 2840 2011 1257 228 268 3127 2787 3829 1794 4325
2106 752 2683 2054 974 3176 3994 3478 768 2916 2565
5530 1615 3843 3888 1325 2784 2606 2411 1241 3279 2309
3706 1173 1857 1999 2308 3925 3865 2094 2457 4621 5149
1908 2313 1801 1907 3447 4695 2340 2615 2740 799 2830
2678 3893 1679 3727 3598 2273 4112 2709 3951 1760 4047
2625 2716 3528 3806 1899 5235 3712

The Business Model is inferior

And UPS is the one who controls the business model. After telling us that the old model was broken, a worse business model was force fed to replace the one that worked.

As I recall, the last year before the "con-version", same store sales Year over Year were only about 5%. Guess, what, they predicted that the new model would increase sales in the typical store by 40% the first year.

Guess what, With an enormous infusion of advertising of the new brand and ballyhoo convincing people to invest in new stores, the year over year sales went up more than 5% the first two years and then plateau'ed. Far less than the 40% goal needed to offset the slashed margins. AND of course, because of the increased percentage of new stores in the mix, the numbers were skewed. New stores starting from zero always show nice increases in the early years even if they never reach profitability. Now that the new model has been in place for five years as of next moday, the average annualized growth is less than 5%, closer to 3% than 5%. Yet, the operating margins have been locked in at the lower levels, while all costs continue to escalate.

UPS mandates the model, it is not surprising that get credit for the failure of the model and that people feel deceived and abused by their actions.

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