PuriFry Vs Filtafry

There is a new Franchise available called PuriFry, in the same market as Filtafry (Some "interesting" comments on this site) has anyone looked at www.purifry.com ?
How do they compare?
Thanks for any comments.

Re: PuriFry Vs Filtafry

I know there base is in the UK.
Do you know if or when PuriFry will move to the US?
I Like there Money Back Guarantee.
You may want to ask over on the Filta Fry thread.
Also have you looked at http://www.manafry.com/

Posted by Guest on February 20th, 2009

Re: Re: PuriFry Vs Filtafry

Hi Bill B, I Guess you dont have anything to ad.

I know there base is in the UK.
Do you know if or when PuriFry will move to the US?
I Like there Money Back Guarantee.
You may want to ask over on the Filta Fry thread.
Also have you looked at http://www.manafry.com/

Posted by Guest on February 23rd, 2009

Filtafryu

Posted by Guest on August 26th, 2009

A warning for those in the UK

Posted by Guest on August 29th, 2009

Cooking oil filtering

Hi I used to have a filterfry franchise years ago , i recomend that you purchase one of my cooking oil filtering machines and do it yourself and save a load of money . Have a look at my video on the website .

Posted by John Beck on August 6th, 2010

Cooking oil filtering

From a x uk franchise owner there is nothing wrong with the filtafry franchise if your prepared to go out and get the customers.

Posted by John Beck on August 6th, 2010

cooking oil filtering

If you look at clearfry you can see a video uk website only.

Posted by John Beck on August 6th, 2010

What's the web site address

Hi John,

what is the web site address for your cooking oil filtering machine?

Thanks,

Andrew

Posted by adbodley on September 9th, 2010

your filtering machine

I to would like your web page. I am thinking of purchasing a filtrafry franchise but if I could do this on my own I would do it. thanks.

Posted by spool on October 10th, 2010

Fryer oil

What is your website, John Beck?

Posted by Guest on February 22nd, 2011

filtafry business experience

Hi, I came across your post on feasibility to do oil filtering without buying a Franchise. I currently have a customer base of 130 restaurants that we clean the exhaust systems for the kitchen. I was looking for another service to offer while we were there, or at least be able to do some other services during the day. I was curious about profitability and the and the business model would look like for filtering oil. Would you be willing to speak with me for a while on the phone? Any input/experience would be great.
John

Onsite Commercial Services
www.azonsite.net

cell 480 216 2626

Posted by Visitor on January 29th, 2014

Facts of franchises that filter oil

Having researched and investigated this industry and attempts to prolong the life the cooking oil for restaurants etc. I can scientifically say that AT BEST, any customer could ever hope to accomplish is break even when factoring in the service costs for franchisee to stop in once, twice or even three times a week. If any deepfryer is not cleaned and filtered thoroghly on a DAILY basis the oil will be left with the contaminents and free fatty acids to act as a catalyst that deteriorate any good oil properties left. If you miss ONE day the end result is that the oil goes right back to the state it was in before that oil franchisee filtered. Yes, you can extend 1, perhaps 2 days of the oil life. Does this maximize ALL of the oils potential? NO! FYI- Carbon is the destroyer of oil and its properties, which is the byproduct of the burned food particles, breading, salt etc. Carbon deposit is .6 microns. Each and every filter media and machine out there can NOT capture these contaminents. Research all you want, ask all the right questions and you will discover this. The oil institute research center has the data to back this up as well. I have also reviewed all available patents and claims on this subject and NOT ONE solution to solve this has yet to be invented yet. FYI- oil subjected to anything over 40 psi breaks the cell wall of the vegetable oil and actually breaks the oil down. FACT. Purifry, filta, manafry and most other attempts to clarify, cleanse or whatever they want to claim is happening to the oil is actually doing just the opposite. The only way to filter properly is through a negative pressure situation.
After 12 months of R & D, trial and error, and hundreds of hours I have finally developed the " 4-part system" that when implemented daily by these food service employees does this task quicker and easier, and will maximize, for the first time, both money and oil life for the customer. I back it writing that this "system" will save them $2000-$20,000 plus per year on their oil costs alone, depending on their current oil practices and use. No franchise b.s., no equipment purchases or contracts for restaurants, and lifetime replacement of any broken or defective equipment.
The BEST PART?
* The restaurant saves thousands in oil and labor

* Employees are safer and happier(they WANT to use this!)

* They are a "Green" eco-friendly business

* All filters and associated products covered for life

* The savings results are AFTER they have covered our costs

* Lifetime residual income for sales rep in place for as long as
customer keeps using the "system" (Why would they not when you have proven to them how much money and better off their fryers and oil are?)

* You obtain 50 accounts and keep them happy and you never have to filter or clean a fryer again, AND nets you $80-85K per year. If you stop putting this "system" in place once you have your 50 accounts, you STILL make this money EVERY YEAR! If you lose an account, go help another food service place save money to get back to your 50 accounts. If you have 30 accounts you will make roughly 50K. If you have 100 acoounts- you make 175K each and every year!

* You are NOT tied down to filtering or cleaning every day-THEY ARE!
* Stop in once a month after they have the "system" to check in and monitor their savings and equipment.

No one in WORLD has this "system" or can duplicate-No competition!

I have restaurants already using this and keep very accurate records as to the savings and claims, Finally...THE REAL DEAL!

I just finished the final steps making this the ultimate user friendly solution. I am now am writing the 40 page business plan for venture capital money to back so I can get this out accross the country. FYI- my customers are filtering daily to .5 microns in less than 10 minutes time and don't have to open their drain ports to do it, and handle 100 lbs. of oil at once! No van needed, you could sell this out of a car trunk! I have been a busy man and have already invested thousands to get to this point.
To say the least, I am excited! This is huge! And it works!
Best of luck to you all!
cleanfryer@gmail.com

Posted by Greaseman on February 26th, 2009

Shill

Geez, Greaseman, why don't you just yell up and down: "I am a shill, shill, shrill shill"?

Michael Webster, a franchisee attorney in Toronto, Ontario, publishes a website on business opportunities and franchises called "The BizOp News"

Posted by michael webster on February 27th, 2009

Shill this

Micheal,
Like you would actually get your hands dirty and bother with a deepfryer. If you think for a second you or any other restaurant manager, owner, mfg. rep of these fryers, oil, filters or what have you, are getting the most out of their oil or have the data and backround to even converse on the subject, you have much to learn.
My friend just spent over 2k in legal fees to his "franchise' attorney to find a way out of his obligation, he was told there was nothing he could do. I spent 2 days researching his contracts and making calls and found 3 legal loopholes, drafted a demand letter, sent it to his franchise...what da ya know? Not only was he released but got a nice check in the mail. This lawyer actually worked for the SCC prior to his practice. He has one of those glamorous high offices with all the bells and whistles. The lawyer called me up afterwards to thank me and said I should think of law. I told him car sales are down and the market is a little slow right now. Like the world needs another one of you out there ripping people off.
I'm curious, with all your clients and legal obligations on your desk at the moment, how is it you have time to slink into sites like this? Please enlighten us all...please we are dying here!
If by chance you can spare a moment of your precious time we would all would like to hear about your vast wealth of knowledge on this particular subject. It seems you have a lot of advice for all of us out there on just about each and every topic under the sun.
Jeopardy awaits. Alex wants to shake your hand as the next winner.
I think you are missing your true calling here!
Or is this the part where you inform us of infinite number of degrees hanging your walls, the cost and type of car, house and clothes you have, that's what we really need at this point.
Fact is- you have no clue as to what I presently have or know about this industry, and never will. Until you jump on your plane and fly in to see me and this "system" (after you sign the confidentiallity of course) will you have the right to even pretend to approach this topic.
Until then, I hear the at home version, readily available at Toys R Us will jumpstart your new future career.

Posted by Greaseman on February 28th, 2009

Response to Shrill Shill

GM writes: "If by chance you can spare a moment of your precious time we would all would like to hear about your vast wealth of knowledge on this particular subject. It seems you have a lot of advice for all of us out there on just about each and every topic under the sun."

1. Your original post made reference to the standard and well known fake earnings claim. This is the sign of a shill.

2. Your original post made reference to 12 months of R&D, with no back up.  This is the sign of a shill.

3.  Your original post made reference to the impossibility of anyone being able to duplicate your system.  This is the sign of a shill.

4.  Your original post made reference to you having, "Finally, the real deal".  This is the sign of a shill.

5.  In your reply, you suggest that you can duplicate the efforts of a highly skilled franchise attorney in drafting a demand letter for rescission that works.  Please post the letter, a copy of the cheque, and your legal authorities.  No doubt this could be a precedent.

6.  In your reply, you suggest you have a system that would disclose to me once I sign your confidentiality agreement.  Send me the confidentiality agreement for my signature.

7.  In your reply, you ask why I post on BMM.  Uh, because people ought not to be tempted into even entering a Pascal wager  with you.  Because you wear the marks of a shill.  And are shrill - yet another mark.

Michael Webster, a franchisee attorney in Toronto, Ontario, publishes a website on business opportunities and franchises called "The BizOp News"

Posted by michael webster on March 1st, 2009

And numbers 8 and 9 for the Greaseman......

In addition to Mr. Webster's 7 signs of a shrill shill, I humbly add:

8. The overuse of exclamation points.

The only thing missing from your spiel is the "act now, before it's too late!!!!"

9. The need to immediately deride anyone who dares question your
contentions, motives or veracity.

If your "plan" is so revolutionary and will save and make so much money, why waste your time trying to convince doubters like the Attorney from the Great White North? If the Emperor is fully clothed, he needn't fear someone claiming he is naked.

The most persuasive arguments are those that require no raising of voice and can comfortably ignore the temptation to attack personally those purportedly uninformed and therefore harmless naysayers.

on March 1st, 2009

One LAST note on the subject for the indoubt

I remain true to my postings and confident of all I say for the fact that I am NOT selling anything. Yes it is true, there are actually good and decent, sound and thought out opportunities available IF it is unique, simple and needed.
I am the finance, risk taking individual on the line, no one else.
I am the one paying these residuals and salaries to those that put this system in place for the restaurants etc. Pure and simple-it is a profit sharing of the actual dollar amount of savings these customers WILL save. My partners and I already have the basis of this "system" in place at over 150 Chili's franchises with at AVERAGE savings of 8-10k per store per year, most in the mideast. Paula Dean now has this in place as well in her restaurant and THEY are projecting at LEAST 30k savings per year from 1 location based on what they are already doing. These are but a few. But I am sure you already knew that too. If indeed this was available elsewhere AND untried, unproven and at the least bit skeptical would they bother?
Anyone who would ever put this system in place or venture to attempt to work at this would be required to put absolutely no money of their own out of pocket. It is my risk, no on else.
In my opinion, you hover around these sites knowing too well there are hundreds of dissatified franchise venturists out there that need answers, and you are their answer. Without franchises and their unique ability to promise the moon and the ultimate solution to their economic "stimulus" what would you write about? Or for that matter, how would you earn a living?
Do you know the backround of whom I partner with? None of us are, or EVER will be associated with a franchise or its concepts.
Pure and simple, you or your friends in Canada take this equipment, carefully analyze beforehand the food service individuals practices of cooking oil management, uses, etc. then IN WRITING put their new savings per year with this system with NO CONTRACT. If they don't like, use it for paperweight, whatever, we take it back at they go back to doing what ever they did before. We ARE that confident in this. But of course, you knew that as well, right.
Boy what a shill I am. Imagine me wanting no money or obligation.
You got me pegged, can't get one over on you franchise attorneys.
My last bit of advice...I would slink back out and find a different rock to hind under BEFORE you do yourself anymore harm.
I hear things are really gellin' over on the Quizno's and Cartridge World sites at the moment...they REALLY need you..BAD!

Posted by Greaseman on March 2nd, 2009

Shill

A village called me, apparently they are looking for you.  

Michael Webster, a franchisee attorney in Toronto, Ontario, publishes a website on business opportunities and franchises called "The BizOp News"

Posted by michael webster on March 2nd, 2009

Sold on Greasemans pitch...

Hello Michael. Im looking into a cheap and affordable start-up I and came across "Mr.Greaseman". From the research I've done he looks pretty legit. Knowing that your spat with him was in the past, do you still feel that his 10-20K buy in is still a far fetch? Im looking for advice on a new franchise concept and would love to hear from a well oiled business man like yourself. I know that the oil filtration service in itself will sell with the proper hard work and motivation, but I really need a reliable filtering machine. Please let me know what you think I should do or where I should go from here. Thanks Michael.

Posted by Guest on June 27th, 2012

I can make you a sturdy filtration machine for 5k - and....

It will do better than anything on the market. Have sold 186 of them throughout the world. Allows 5 different types of filtration and goes down to .5 microns.

Save your dough buying an opportunity. We'll let you come to our office and drive around with our techs and sales guys for free in the San Francisco Bay Area. You can talk to our restaurant owners about how they enjoy the work the machine does.

Most of our clients we are able to extend their oil to 10-14 days.

Posted by Kitchen Butler on September 3rd, 2012

reply to Kitchen Butler

Can you forward to me info about your equipment and contact info?
to: serviceworks@comcast.net

Posted by HG on February 4th, 2013

oil purification

can you send details of your oil purification machine to coimbatore2ndchance@gmail.com

Posted by Guest on February 24th, 2013

Oil Filtration Equipment

Hello, please send additional details, sounds interesting.

Posted by Visitor on May 3rd, 2013

microfiltration equipment

are you still selling microfiltration cooking oil equipment ?

best regards

Posted by roberto bandres on February 7th, 2014

Now I have heard it all..really?

As far as KB is concerned here is what I know about them:

1) they started and teamed up with an outfit out of North/South Carolina
RefriedMeans? A guy called me shortly after this merger as he had just sunk over 5k into this "sturdy machine" and was crying about what he had received for his money. (He lives in the Nags Head, NC area)He was sent a machine in pieces with various parts missing and a marketing/business manual that had bet cheaply put together at Kinko's or the like. After many calls and emails he finally gave up.
This was supposed to save his other business his wife was running and all the money he had. I was saddened to hear of this loss and suffering. He had no money to purchase my machine.
2) Based on the information he shared with me on what exactly he purchased and received it was clearly determined(the manual, etc) he was sold a business opportunity and not just a machine. KB is based and run as a California LLC company and NOT registered as last checked, with the California State Corporation Commission (Calisi?)to sell business opportunities which is a strict FTC and state violation. 26 states require this business opportunity licensing.
3) In reviewing their website and information gathered elsewhere about KB, I feel it necessary to voice my concerns and opinions about what they really offer:
* I see a machine randomly put together and looking unprofessional, i.e.- no cover or lid, small casters, a one way pump, and the individuals working with that machine having to pick it up (almost 100 pounds and if they just used it recently, still VERY hot to touch!) to load in their van.
* They mention many times they would use different filters which would all of course have have different functions and final filtration capacities....WHY?
I would be almost 100% sure that EVERY filter they use is not proprietary and can be purchase by anyone. Why would they feel the need to use different filters for different customers anyway? This makes absolutely ZERo sense, unless of course these filters cannot handle the crumbs, get clogged OR more importantly, cannot be used with a superior fry oil powder for true depth filtration(with this powder you might as well not filter at all With that being said, there are better machines for sale on the internet already from $1500- $2500. Keep in mind, theirs and these others are NOT built or equipped to be used as and for a business application. WHY?
1) small low profile design with only a 1-way pump. Most of the fryers I service
would never work with this machine as the oil and substantial crumb load will restrict the oil flow from the bottom oil drain valve of the fryers.
2) no hot oil vacuum in use? really?
3) no cover or lid- accident waiting to happen and unsafe with HOT oil spills etc
4) try pushing this machine up and down curbs, alleys, ramps, long hallways, elevators or the like and see how long (or if at all possible)it will hold up.

I could go on, but I think you get my point. If you really believe that filtering once a week will will as they claim "extend the oil 10-14 days" Then I think you need to buy their machine. Best of luck with that one. Don't say I didn't warn you. We have serviced over 3000 fryers since 2010, colleges, hospitals, chains, all kinds of food, fryers and oil and just about, if not every possible situation presentable in the commercial kitchen. Not once have I experience even close to those results. FYI- We use a .5 (1/2) micron DOUBLE filter with Magnesol
oil extender fry powder (McDonald's Corp uses this in every facility daily, ask yourself why would they spend the money and how much they spent to analyze it?)
If you talking about the truth and portraying actual results:
If a typical restaurant normally changes their oil twice per week, you will be able to cut that in half and get a week. Every 7 days, now they might see 11-12 days tops. Again, why believe me, go buy theirs. What do I know.

If you want a REAL alternative to this or the "filtering franchise" and one that has been tested and proven superior to anything ever built AND actually built for this purpose go to EBAY.COM then search for FRYER FILTER MACHINE.
It is $6500. Do your homework and research BEFORE you jump on anyone's empty promises. Any questions please call anytime. See you soon!

on May 1st, 2014

fryer oil filtration

Thanks for your informative post. Do you sell the machine you use? Also do offer any training for the equipment and offer any marketing assistance or advice?
Thanks, Paul Grenz.

on June 29th, 2015

fryer oil filtration

Thanks for your informative post. Do you sell the machine you use? Also do offer any training for the equipment and offer any marketing assistance or advice?
Thanks, Paul Grenz.

on June 29th, 2015

Oiled, greased or lubricated?

This Guest says: "Im looking for advice on a new franchise concept and would love to hear from a well oiled business man like yourself."

Just what the whole world was waiting for, a NEW FRANCHISE CONCEPT  !!!

So is Michael well oiled, well GREASED, or just well lubricated?

on September 4th, 2012

Do you have a website? I'd

Do you have a website? I'd like to read more.

(you have to admit, those posting are pretty funny)

Posted by Guest on October 19th, 2009

Michael and Mufflerman

You guys are so funny.  I can't stop laughing.

on March 2nd, 2009

Call now!!! You know we can't

Call now!!! You know we can't make this offer all day!!!

Posted by Guest on October 19th, 2009

Re:(Missleading) "Facts" of Franchises that Filter Oil

A blatant advertisement if ever I have seen one and I think it should be recognised as such and removed from a "Franchise" discussion thread, I will refrain from following this trend.

I will say that based on a decade of actual industry experience (Not just 12 months R&D) I would argue a considerable portion of you claims.

"Carbon is the destroyer of oil and its properties" not strictly true, there are many factors oxidation (air), polymerization (heat)and hydrolysis (water & food)that lead to oil degredation, carbon is not the major contributer you indicate. In a fryer that is cleaned on a reasonably regular basis there is minimal carbon, there will be a lot of food particles but they mainly sink to the bottom into the cool zone and burn no further, the main carbon effect is around the edges where if the fryer is not cleaned regularly the grease build up will burn on and carbonize, your "system" does not take off this carbon which in the carbon stakes is a far greater threat to the oil than the particles that may be actually free floating in it.

"At best break even after paying for the service" - I have proof of customers using a Mobile Fryer Service saving small to considerable sums per week, (I can say that mathematically, not scientifically, but its the maths that count) never mind the additional benefits they get - therefore a missleading claim on your part.

"Purifry, filta, manafry and most other attempts to clarify, cleanse or whatever they want to claim is happening to the oil is actually doing just the opposite" Pressure systems do not exceed the 40psi stated , (In fact they are well below 30psi, did your "research" turn up this fact)therefore this statement is irrelevant, totally missleading, and potentially libelous.

Carbon deposits 0.6 micron? it is carbon deposits the filters remove - not individual particles of carbon, catch yourself on!! 2 micron is more than adequate, have you ever actually seen oil filtered in a pressure system?

Shall I go on??

Ok I shall on just 1 more claim, because I find it amazing "* Employees are safer and happier(they WANT to use this!)" How can it be safer to promote employees spending additional time in the vicinity of a deep fat fryer at 180oC using a system that is filtering oil - and the ultimate claim the employees are "happier", never have I come across any kitchen staff that are happy to take on additional time consuming and potentially dangerous duties LOL.

I was going to stop there, but "* The restaurant saves thousands in oil and labor" needs to be commented on, you are asking them to do ADDITIONAL work using your product, how does this save on labor?

Does your system improve Health & Safety, Cleanliness, reduce staff hours, improve kitchen efficiency etc. NO, probably the complete opposite in fact. You are comparing an extensively used proven "Service" with an unproven, commercially unavailable and un-marketed "system", Horses for courses buddy!

A little logic applied and analysis of you profit claims, this is on par as a profit margin per customer with a mobile filtering service, this means as far as your system goes, and a comparison against other inhouse filtration and a mobile service (With the additional benefits the customer gets) you are VERY expensive - time to review your "40 page business plan"

"Greaseman" please do not make any further derogatory comments about a service industry you are obviously lambasting in order to promote the perceived "Additional" benefits of you own product/system, for your information there are systems available that where launched in the 1950's doing exactly what you claim yours does for a lot less - ie saves money with in house filtration, possibly in a different way, but it definitely sounds like you are a bit behind the times and unfortunately have wasted "thousands" reinventing the wheel. Times have moved on, along with customers expectations.

I have said my bit and will not respond to any further comments by greaseman, if anyone else has any relevant questions I am more than happy to respond.

Posted by Industry Insider on March 7th, 2009

Misleading Facts of Franchises that Filter Oil

I would be curious to hear from you, Industry Insider, about how (micro)filtration will remove the soluble baddies in the oil which ultimately lead to oil degradation. I can't see how this filtration done several times a week will solve that problem. If this approach really were to be successful, then the additional benefits would certainly be interesting. Of course, some treatment is better than none. It is possible to see how this service might benefit kitchens which do no oil conditioning, but for those which take oil economics and quality very seriously, daily and actually several times daily conditioning seems to be the norm....however, I am just learning at this point. Can you comment?

Posted by Learning The Ropes on March 7th, 2009

I am interested in obtaining

I am interested in obtaining more specific info. on this four part system.

Posted by robert on February 16th, 2010

info

Did you get info back about cleanfry? I would like to see this system in use.

Posted by Guest on April 22nd, 2010

I have been researching

I have been researching FiltaFry and other oil cleaning systems and would like to know more about your system.

Posted by Jack C. Morris on July 26th, 2010

Bad idea

Nothing against working hard, but filta has zero integrity.

on June 27th, 2015

OIL Filtration

I am excited about your concept.

Send me more info.

Thanks

Tony Shaw

Posted by Tony Shaw on October 21st, 2010

can you send me more

can you send me more information about your franchaise

Posted by brendan on April 5th, 2011

I would like some more

I would like some more information on this

Posted by Steve H on July 31st, 2011

Intereted In Sellimg Your Product

Dear Clean Fryer
Please call me at 970-379-9007.
Thank You.
Dave Stone
Fridgetek,Inc.

Posted by Guest on January 12th, 2012

Please send more info

Did you get your capital, are you ready to "get this out accross the country"? I"m interested.

Posted by Laura on October 10th, 2012

Your Product

I just finished reading you article and would like more information.
Thank You

Posted by Al on October 12th, 2012

what have you discovered beyound this blog. whats your theory

Hey i just read your blog and i am curious to see where you are at today i am looking into offering a service to my clients in my area i see filtafryer around daily and they suck so some of my clients have asked me to research this more. so if there is anything you can teach me tricks what actually works and where hou have been i would love to chat

Posted by Anthony Ruiz on January 2nd, 2013

what have you discovered beyound this blog. whats your theory

Hey i just read your blog and i am curious to see where you are at today i am looking into offering a service to my clients in my area i see filtafryer around daily and they suck so some of my clients have asked me to research this more. so if there is anything you can teach me tricks what actually works and where hou have been i would love to chat

Posted by Anthony Ruiz on January 2nd, 2013

your clients

You refer to your "clients" wanting you to do this.  What do you do for them now?

on January 3rd, 2013

Information

I would be interested in receiving information about your offer/product.
Thank you,
Terry Vance

on January 8th, 2017

what's the advantage...

What would the advantage to a prospective Zee be, to buy into a new Zor? If the "concept" (which is much over-rated in importance since there is hardly any really new or patentable "concept" out there) is a ground floor growth opportunity, then invest in the Zor not the Zee.

Not to ALWAYS be negative, but just so ya know, we are multi-unit restaurant Zors and we already filter our own vats daily and when we change oil we have hard piped pump discharge to a bulk collection tank. We then SELL the used oil.

So I suppose filtration could be a business but it is not new or unique. I would think that only a small Mom & Pop and/or an operator with very backwards and lazy procedures would not already be doing this in-house. I have heard of Filta having national accounts but how many units of those national brands are they really servicing?

This sounds like buying yourself a job and personally that is nto a job I'd choose. But then again I don't want to clean restrooms (US Term, the WC elsewhere) and that too is (or was) a service business.

on February 21st, 2009

is it posible to buy the filter machine use'd by filtafry in uk

Can any one tell me if it's posible to buy the same filter machine as used by filtafry and purifry ,and is it even any good at what it does .how mutch does it cost is it worth it ? is their a good market for this service seems like their would be but you can never be sure

Posted by cammy on May 30th, 2009

contact them at

contact them at

www.cardev.com

I'm not sure if they are still around though.

Posted by Guest on October 19th, 2009